No Contact: Because Their Evil is Contagious

I loosely follow my stats. If I see a bunch of hits coming from one site then I'll follow the link to see what the chatter is. In no less than four different forums in the last month the subject of whether or not the narcissist can be saved has been going on. Whenever this subject comes up rather a lot of heat is generated on both sides. Both sides have very personal reasons for fighting for their view for reasons you can all likely understand. It is usually a Christian who is contending for the view of the narcissist that requires an eternal optimism for their salvation and which usually is the means of justifying, yea, demanding, that people never give up on them. When this subject comes up someone puts up a link to my site as support for the Narcissist Is Doomed to Hell view point.

I think I will, for the sake of future discussions along this line, clarify my position. I think my position is already clear but I'll make it more clear just because the emotionality of this subject seems to disengage some people's logic centers. I speak of those of the Never Give Up, Never Surrender ilk.

Here is what I haven't said. I haven't said that God can't save the narcissist. In fact, I've said the opposite. I have said that God can save the narcissist but with the addendum that He doesn't need YOU to do it! We must have an expiration date on our patience with evil doers.

A year ago I dealt at length with one of the apostle Paul's very clear commands concerning what we should do about those who practice evil in the church family (and by extension, our own families) in the post titled "From Such Turn Away". I don't believe that "love thy neighbor" negates the force of Paul's command. You can't take one text to annul another text and properly exegete the Bible. Context is everything. Too often people make a passage say something it isn't by not putting it into context. Apparent contradictions can be explained when one takes the effort to understand the big picture. I want to present a bigger picture on the Biblical view of what God's people are expected to do about evil in their midst by adding a few more texts into the mix.

Whether one reads the Old Testament or the New Testament it becomes clear rather quickly that God teaches that evil is contagious. There are so many parts of Scripture that teach this it would become very cumbersome to try to list them all. This truth is a given throughout all the Bible and is the very core understanding that is central to every Biblical command to separate from evildoers -- especially and primarily evildoers in the church and home.

It is this core truth which those Christians who insist on eternal patience with evil doers must either ignore willfully or who are just ignorant of all together. I'll say it again: evil is contagious. It is contagious because evil isn't satified to be evil all by itself. It actively works to co-opt you into its evil. And when you join them in their evil they applaud and approve of you (Romans 1:32).

You, the reader of this blog, have likely seen enough of the world and life to have your own observations to call upon to illustrate this truth. You've seen the contagion of evil infect from person to person in your own family. Or the workplace. Or perhaps you've found yourself co-opted for a time into someone else's evil deeds. The understanding that evil is contagious is understood by all good parents. Most parents will guard the associations of their children because they know that bad influences are very likely to lead children and teens into bad behaviors. Evil doers are never satisfied to be alone in their deeds. They want accomplices. To corrupt their peers is essential in order to be able to carry on their evil with a minimum of moral judgment or risk of exposure. Evil doers are not confined by truth or by morality if it stands in the way of getting what they want. So this amplifies the persuasive power of evil. Because it can and does lie to get its way; because it can create a false reality; because it can use the implements of cruelty, bribery, violence and exercise of any and all power it may possess without moral considerations -- all this increases the likelihood that evil doers will create other evil doers.

Having elaborated a bit in the paragraph above about the FACT that evil is like a virus that will infect those who remain in close contact with it I have again underlined the central reason I so energetically urge "no contact" with the malignant narcissist. To avoid picking up their traits, to avoid being used by them as a "cat's paw" to hurt others, to avoid becoming indifferent to evil and therefore more likely to be evil oneself, it is essential to separate yourself from it. For a Christian to urge the opposite is to reveal themselves to be profoundly ignorant of the Bible or, I fear, profoundly over-confident of their ability to not be co-opted by evil. A confidence the Scriptures do not urge us to have!

Another aspect of my urging "no contact" with evil doers is your responsibility to protect the most vulnerable and most innocent ones whom you are in a position to protect. This, too, is the Biblical view as the Bible holds those in positions of authority responsible for the temporal and eternal well-being of those in their care. So, even if you feel overly confident of your imperviousness to yielding to evil doers in your family or church I do not see on what basis you are confident of the unyielding nature of the vulnerable and innocent in your charge. Parents are responsible before God to protect their young from evil, church leaders for their 'flock', kings for their people, etc.

Evil doers in the family are not granted a special exemption by God! Evil doers are in the best position to harm those who are closest to them by reason of familial ties. Family ties are not any justification for evil else we condemn each new generation to endless repetititions of evil doers in the familial circle. The cycle has to be broken at some point or entire families will be destroyed. There are historical examples of this going back as far as recorded history goes. Like begets like. Evil spreads. Entire nations can be eventually consumed by unchecked evil in families.


All this means that Christians who agitate for the idea that we are not true, loving Christians if we don't emulate their own eternal patience with evil are actually only perpetuating evil rather than spreading good as they claim. Eternal patience with evil is equal with being a despiser of the good and the innocent!

Don't be cowed by the unflinching self-righteousness of those who claim to be better than you because they won't give up hope that God will save the narcissist. Recognize the false premise in their reasoning. They reason thus: if you walk away (i.e. give up on) the narcissist you have, at the same time, shown that you don't believe God can save the narcissist. Walking away says no such thing! God is not rendered powerless to save anyone just because you've had to go 'no contact' to end your exposure to their evil! Where in the Bible has God said that every person we will ever come in contact with will be saved by God through us?? It is no where even hinted at such a notion. The arrogance inherent in believing that God can only use YOU to save a particular person is quite odious when you recognize it for what it is. You are not that important. Or powerful. Get over yourself.


Some more texts to consider carefully because they enjoin us to separate from evil doers and trouble-makers.


Romans 16:17-18. Notice that those who are co-opted by the "divisive" ones are called naive. Other versions use the term "simple" or "simpletons". The Bible marks those Christians who can't discern the evil acts of their brothers in Christ to be simpletons. Remember that when one of those simpletons come to you to accuse you of being ignorant! Oh, the irony of it. Also remember that the Christian church is called a family and its structure is modelled on the family. What applies to the church family can be rightly applied to the family you were born into.


1 Corinthians 5:9-13. As in Paul's instruction to Timothy where he says "from such turn away" Paul is very specific about whom we should be shunning in his letter to the Corinthians. He says that if he told God's church to turn away from ALL evil doers then the Christian would have to leave the world. Paul says this is obviously impossible so obviously he wasn't telling Christians to avoid all the evil doers in the world. He was telling them how to deal with those in the church. This is entirely consistent with the view of the contagiousness of evil. That evil which is closest to us is the most dangerous form. Paul was much more concerned about prospering evil doers in the church than in the world at large because evil disguising itself in Christian garb is much more persuasive to other Christians than some stranger outside the circle of the church family. He concludes his admonition with this unequivocal command which is a quote from the Old Testament (Deut. 13:5), "Expel the wicked man from among you." There is no special clemency for evil doers just because they are in the family. The very opposite is true. Paul is clear that we are to judge those closest to us...not those furthest away. Those who call themselves family (church or birth) are the most accountable to us for their behavior!

The law that was handed down in the book of Deuteronomy was to govern the family of Israel. Israel was a family, a denominated church and a nation all rolled into one. We can learn much from God's commands to Israel about both church and family government. We don't see God telling His people to cut extra slack to evil doers in their families or nation. No slack cutting...cut them off is the command! Paul's quoting of this command in the New Testament shows that its instruction is in full force for the Christian.

Please note that Paul puts sexual immorality next to greed. Idolatry is just as evil as slander. A drunk is as evil as the swindler. However you may categorize evil, if you call yourself Christian I hope you won't put yourself above Paul and describe greed or slander as less evil than the other sins listed. The habit of those who've long lived with the evil narcissist have usually come to excuse greater sins than these in them. Don't minimize what the Bible calls evil and exhorts you to separate yourself from!

Psalm 26:4-5, NIV A psalm of David. "I do not sit with deceitful men nor do I consort with hypocrites; I abhor the assembly of evildoers and refuse to sit with the wicked." Which Christian is it who can claim to be better esteemed of God than David? I daresay, none. Will you show your greater righteousness by sitting with the wicked and joining in their assemblies?

Psalm 97:10, NIV "Let those who love the LORD hate evil, for he guards the lives of his faithful ones and delivers them from the hand of the wicked." Are you better than the Lord Himself? He hates evil. Do you? Notice the promise of deliverance from the hand of the wicked. What would that be but a promise of 'no contact'. A blessed relief from their persecutions.

Proverbs 2 Click on the link to read its entirety. In it Solomon explains the blessings that proceed from listening to and acquiring wisdom and understanding. "Discretion will protect you,
and understanding will guard you. Wisdom will save you from the ways of wicked men, from men whose words are perverse, who leave the straight paths to walk in dark ways, who delight in doing wrong and rejoice in the perverseness of evil, whose paths are crooked and who are devious in their ways." Wisdom and understanding are presented as the means whereby God can protect you from wicked people. Hello!!??? Can you hear me?? You can be an idiot and make it impossible for God to protect you! You were given a brain and are expected by God to use it. What does this chapter end with but this rather good news, "the wicked will be cut off from the land, and the unfaithful will be torn from it." Again, I ask, who of you is better than God who cuts off the wicked? From my view none of you are better than God Himself. Therefore, I will not listen to you who believe that the "good" Christian will never cut off the malignant narcissist. I can only see you as a coddler of the wicked not a protector of the innocent and the virtuous. Your eternal patience for the evil doer is taken by them to be a license to continue on as they are. Never cutting them off allows the evil doer to feel justified in what they are and in what they do.

It is because God loves people that He instructs them to cut off the wicked. It is not from hatred of the evil person himself. God hates evil because it destroys the evil doer and all those in the evil doer's grasp. The Bible records that God has many times executed the death penalty upon the wicked and many choose to see Him as being too harsh for doing so. Yet they would forget the many crimes of the wicked to accuse God in that way. God has killed evil doers with the express purpose of saving those who are still save-able. He states clearly that He takes no pleasure in the death of the wicked. (Ezekiel 33:11) The destruction of the wicked is elsewhere called His "strange act" (Isaiah 28:21). Be assured, cutting off the wicked is an act of justice and mercy dispensed by God to preserve those not given over to evil. Don't pretend to be better than God Himself by refusing His instructions to distance yourself from those who won't distance themselves from evil deeds. He expects you to use wisdom. Wisdom is the conduit whereby He is able to shape circumstance to protect you. Wisdom is a function of logical thought. Which means you follow your head and not your fickle little heart when confronted with having to deal with evil. Family ties are not an automatic exemption from all instruction concerning evil. Family is more accountable to us, not less, for their closeness.

I'll say it one more time before closing. Cutting off the evil narcissist is not a commentary on your believing that God can't save that person. Going no contact with the malignant narcissist doesn't mean God has gone no contact with him. Please, don't be a simpleton. God can still reach them even if you never speak another word to them. Because the Biblical instruction to the Christian is unequivocal that we must "Therefore put away from among yourselves that wicked person", don't expect God's protection if you refuse His clear command on this point. And believe me, there will come a day when the trap springs and there will be no help for you.

"Discretion will protect you, and understanding will guard you. Wisdom will save you from the ways of wicked men, from men whose words are perverse." Prov. 2:11-12

"A prudent man sees danger and takes refuge, but the simple keep going and suffer for it." Prov. 22:3

Refresher on the Savior Complex

I stumbled across a draft for a blog post that I started almost a year ago and never finished. I'll post it now cuz, hey, it still applies. It was only two paragraphs long when I last saved it, but there is something to be said for brevity. Especially around here where I mostly go on at great length. Hang on, I can probably manage to make this another long post. *grin*

I rankle at the unconsciously grandiose thinking of many Christians that they must save the narcissist. Like their very presence is necessary in order for God to work some miracle in the narcissist. It is this kind of thinking that keeps narcissists fed and good people dancing with evil. Even though there is no biblical foundation for the belief that we must stay in relationships with evil people, Christians go on blithely with their savior complexes never conceptualizing that their savior complex is naive at best, enabling of evil at worst. It is like all the Scriptures which categorically command us to distance ourselves from evil don't apply if we are married to it or related to it. Which flies in the face of Christ's own words. See Matt. 10:37.

Let me say this about a 'savior complex'.

Point one: a savior complex is actually a denial of the power of God to save.

Point two: Therefore, it shows your unbelief, not your great faith, in God's power.

Point three: it is indicative of a need you have to control. You think that by staying in a close relationship with a narcissist that you can somehow be there for that moment where the narcissist is suddenly open to 'salvation'. Only you have the ability to see that crystalline moment of recognition and exploit it to the salvation of the narcissist. A savior complex reveals you think too highly of yourself.

Can you see that thinking you must be there for the narcissist to be saved is not a proof or proclamation of your great faith in God? It is the very opposite! It is proof of how much confidence you have in yourself, not the confidence you have in your God.

A savior complex is a denial of the power of God's own Spirit to work out the mysterious power of salvation in a life without your power accompanying it.

God knows we have no power to save another human being. He doesn't ask us to save. He asks us to present truth. He then tells us that if that truth is rejected we are to move on. "Do not cast your pearls before swine" was Christ's instruction. He told the disciples to carry the truth to the various towns. If the truth was rejected they were to stamp the very dust of that town off of their shoes and leave. Endless importunities were not prescribed. The stamping of the dust off the shoes was a symbol. A symbol of the discharge of their responsibility toward those people. They had presented the truth. The truth was rejected. Therefore, the responsibility toward that truth was now resting on the people, not the bearer of truth. The disciples would be wasting their energy and efforts by staying and pleading with those who rejected truth. Christ would have them move on to more promising fields of labor and not waste their limited time, energy or resources on an endless quest to convince the un-convinceable. Learn from the Word of God that a belief in your powerful presence as an agent of change for the narcissist is not a virtue and is working in opposition to how God actually works.

Side note: Christ didn't declare those towns which rejected the Gospel as damned. He simply told the disciples to move on knowing they were relieved before God of their responsibility. It doesn't mean God was done working with those people. It meant that He would bring in different agencies and circumstances to hopefully open up closed hearts to His truth. Just because you've discharged your duty doesn't mean there is no hope left. It only means you are not going to be the direct instrument of God's hand. Perhaps an indirect one. Maybe God knows you would take the glory if you were there for the moment of someone's conversion. So, He has you plant the seed and move on in order to preserve the integrity of your soul. Think about that.

Now, to the aborted post of last summer.

****************************

Christians...listen up. All the platitudes and bromides you've been weaned on do not apply to narcissists. Quit coddling, excusing, justifying and enabling evil to thrive. Your well-intentioned desire to "save" the narcissist is back-firing. You are supporting evil when you don't hold evil people accountable for their behavior.

Christians, of all people, should be the last ones who excuse or support evil people, yet, somehow, they do it everyday thinking themselves to be good Christians by giving a pass to out right evil behaviors just so they look like "nice" people. Turn on your brains and think. Stop acting how you think you should act in order to impress all your friends with your great Christian heart. Sometimes the right thing to do isn't necessarily the "nice" thing. The Gospel of Nice is not the Gospel of Christ. You are morally weak if you are giving a pass to evil narcissists. Period. Yes, even if that narcissist is your parent.

As I've stated in recent posts, when you decide to stop feeding the narcissist, when you quit playing by their rules, you have declared war. The narcissist is in this war to maintain what they value most...power over you. You are in the war to eradicate evil from your sphere of influence.

This is serious business. No one enters war lightly. Count the costs before you engage; once engaged, do not settle for less than victory.

********************************

I wrote this abortive post last August. A few days later I wrote, "When Good is Bad". The closing paragraphs from this post go into greater detail on what you've just read above:

It is no small thing to let your goodness be exploited, used, and manipulated by predatory narcissists. Your good qualities are only good if they support good. All too often people fall for the notion that their eternal patience and determined belief in the good of all people will cause others to rise to the occasion. The narcissist will never rise to this occasion in the way you hope. They will only see opportunity for protective coloration by standing very close to you and letting your goodness hide their badness.

It is imperative for you, your family, and your social circle that you engage your rational powers and start discerning between good and evil. Discernment = judgment. Not a bad word. I have said before that "nice people suck". In this context, of how "nice" people often let themselves be used by evil people, I am speaking. There is a time for everything. Always being "nice" is a sign that you do not understand there is a time to not be "nice". There is a time to judge. A time to take an unpopular stand. A time to hold evil-doers to account no matter the cost to you. A time to protect the innocent and abused from those who have very successfully hidden their malignancy heretofore. A time for war.

The only time we should engage with evil is to defeat it. Quit trying to reason with evil. Evil is, by its very nature, unreasonable. Quit trying to save the evil. Evil recognizes no need for salvation.

Show how great your faith in God is by leaving the saving to Him.

As Per Request...

I was asked to revisit the comment that I parsed out in this post and make a more thorough job of it. The request came because I had glossed over a couple of paragraphs due to my boredom with the lame arguments therein. Because the request was coming from someone who found themselves disquieted by those glossed-over-by-me paragraphs I have found the motivation to finish the job. I don't want anyone to be struggling with residual discomfort from the words of an ignorant, drive-by Christian. I will pick up where I left off. The commenter's words are in italics.

God's word gives us clear principles to live by as far as dealing with those who are living in sin.

Yes, it does give us those "clear principles". The principles vary depending on whether or not the sinner is a repentant one or not. This person doesn't acknowledge that fact. Many of the claims of this commenter I have dealt with in my second post on the 5th commandment. In my post, "A Wicked Man", I deal with the problem of other Christians instructing us to stay in a relationship with an evil person, and how doing so contradicts God's own commands.

We are no better. Their sinful selfish attitude is no worse than any one of our sins. We all need the SAME Grace.

While I do not argue that we all are recipients of the same grace, I find it repugnant to pull the moral equivalence gambit when we are talking about the kinds of cruel abuses and predatory and evil behaviors of malignant narcissists. There is a chasm of difference between a sinner who recognizes their need for forgiveness and salvation and the malignant narcissist who consistently and persistently practices his life of vileness all the while acting like they need no such grace. Sorry, you can't make those two things equal and be any kind of consistent or rational. Or Biblical.

If we are truly going to deal with Narcissism in a Biblical manner then we need to use all of God's word not just parts of it to fulfill our own needs and desires.

Which is what I do...and what this commenter has not done. In the very blog post this person was commenting on he/she had overlooked strong Biblical statements which are positive commands for Christians to "walk away" from evil doers. I'm not the one picking and choosing which part of God's word to follow.

Just in case you are wondering, my mother is narcissistic. I was raised by her. Still struggling with her.

I think we can all understand why this person is "still struggling" with their narcissistic mother. That struggle will last until the old woman is laid in her grave.

But I will not adhere to un-biblical principals just to satisfy my own selfish desires to be "free of her". I want to do things God's way and help to restore her to her Saviour and our relationship to one that God wants it to be.

This is an naked accusation. By that I mean the accusation bears no proof with it. The accusation is laid, and the pretense which goes along with it is that this accusation alone proves the author's point. It does no such thing. Where is their proof that I am presenting un-biblical principals to support my so-called selfish desires? I have laid out the biblical support for my statements. Where is this persons proof? The only texts they presented demonstrably support my view, not theirs.

The next few words reveal the basis of their emotional fervor: the belief that the redemption of their mother is dependent on this person's own faith and spiritual virtue. I have already identified this as proceeding from a savior complex. Please read here and here. I know some Christians feel like they are demonstrating a lack of faith in their God's ability to save someone if they should walk away from the evil doer. This is itself unbiblical. God can save...you can't. Get over yourself, get out of the way, let God do His thing. He doesn't need you to hang in there for eternity with an evil doer in order to save the evil doer. He has specifically told you to get away from the persistent evil doer. Quit disobeying the God you are pretending to be obeying.

Dividing us is Satan's work.

This kind of categoric statement annoys me to no end. Probably because it is becoming such a popular mantra in Christianity. I mentally roll my eyes now when I hear this one. I heard it so many times from my sister that it became a standard part of her phone calls to me for years. There was "war in heaven". God Himself took up some kind of arms against the angelic rebels in order to "cast them out. See this post. Christ boldly proclaimed He is a divider when he said he "came not to send peace but a sword". Matt. 10:34-36. "I came to set at variance..." Um, looks to me like Christ himself is laying claim to being a divider. Strong words to claim that all division is "Satan's work". This person has condemned their own Savior.

By the way, ya'll may find it mildly interesting that the commenter above came back to my blog yesterday afternoon. Since I wrote down all their particulars, ISP, IP address, city, state, google search words, I immediately noticed the stats when the person came back. I kept track of the info because I was curious to see if this person would be returning to my blog. Well, they did. Using the exact same search words, "biblical view of narcissism", they hopped onto my blog via the very post where I parsed out their own comment. This person then did about 10 page views spending about 35 minutes on the blog. Their "out click" was the comments on the blog post, "Breathing Example of Last Post". So this person saw not only what I had to say, but what you all had to say too. The part I find especially interesting about this is that they didn't come back with another comment. Take that to mean what you will. I have my own ideas on what that means.

Breathing Example Illustrating Last Post

I wrote a post in February titled, "From Such Turn Away". If you want to get the full impact of what is to follow I hope you'll go back and re-read my post. It is the context within which the comment I'm going to address was made. It is important to see exactly what this person chose to ignore in order to make the statements he or she did.

Assuming you've done your little homework assignment above, I'll proceed.

The person whose comment you'll be reading found my blog on 4.7.08 @ 6:48 a.m. by doing a Google search, "biblical view of narcissism". Google landed this person on the blog post above. This is the only post on my blog that this person read. They read, clicked on 'comment', did their thang and left. Obviously, this person doesn't believe that my blog presents a biblical view of narcissism. You'll soon see why.

I have gone to considerable effort to deal with the clubs that are used on Christians by Christians. I have done so with deliberation and careful examination of the texts which have been used to keep Christians under the rule of narcissists in home and church. This is probably the reason I read this comment and felt exasperated. I have debunked everything this person says in various posts on my blog. I have done so thoroughly and thoughtfully so the idea that I have to start all over again with someone like this kinda overwhelms me.

Well, I'm not gonna. No need to re-invent the wheel--especially for someone who obviously is not open to any idea other than the one dessicated and shriveled idea that is rattling around in their empty cranium. Rather than approve this comment and let it sit there on that post trying to negate the whole of my blog, I thought I would bring it front and center. Posting that comment requires an answer from me. I found myself wishing this person had bothered to stick around and go to the newest post on my blog because they would have had my answer to their reasoning. Anyway, the comment has value which is why I didn't just flush it away. It's value is related to the subtitle of my blog. This person managed to distill down into remarkably few words all the reasoning that is normally used to keep victims as victims. The toxic and poisonous thinking that causes our homes and churches to willingly host the predators among us is present in this comment:

While I agree with what you said about Narcissism being a sin problem, I think it is extremely dangerous to tell people that it is not curable. All things can be done through Christ. There is no incurable personality disorder.

I also do not agree with you telling people to leave, or get away from Narcissistic people. A child can not get away from a narcissistic parent, and a wife/husband should NOT divorce their narcissistic spouse. God hates divorce more than he hates selfishness. Satan is more than happy to divide families and marriages.

Since a narcissist does not believe they are doing anything wrong, they will not understand why you are distancing yourself from them. I believe it is cruel to cut yourself off from someone unless they can completely understand the reasons behind it and learn to change their ways so they can have fellowship with you again. (Matthew 18:15-18, Galatians 6:1, 1 Corinthians 5) If you can not follow Biblical principals in discipline with a person then distancing yourself from them is as wrong as their attitude.

God's word gives us clear principles to live by as far as dealing with those who are living in sin. We are no better. Their sinful selfish attitude is no worse than any one of our sins. We all need the SAME Grace.

If we are truly going to deal with Narcissism in a Biblical manner then we need to use all of God's word not just parts of it to fulfill our own needs and desires.

Just in case you are wondering, my mother is narcissistic. I was raised by her. Still struggling with her. But I will not adhere to un-biblical principals just to satisfy my own selfish desires to be "free of her". I want to do things God's way and help to restore her to her Saviour and our relationship to one that God wants it to be. Dividing us is Satan's work. Posted by Anonymous to Narcissists Suck at Apr 7, 2008 7:21:00 AM

We have here the absolute assertion that we can't consider a malignant narcissist incurable which is a classic demonstration of a 'savior complex'. I deal with that here. I never say that any person is beyond God's help. I only admit the reality that some people are beyond the help of us mere mortals. The Bible agrees with me on this point.

Then we're told that there is no justification for ever divorcing a malignant narcissist, and to do so is labeled as being the dividing work of Satan. We've never heard that one before, right? Not real original, but it is brought out with regularity by the narcissist's cultists.

This person then argues that we can't leave a narcissist without it being cruel because they are incapable of understanding they are wrong...and therefore incapable of understanding our reasons for leaving. Another dose of savior complex is thrown into this nugget. This reasoning goes round and round forever which leaves people with zero justification for leaving an abusive malignant narcissist (and all malignant narcissists are abusive in one way or another). This person dares to make us more cruel than the narcissist simply for leaving. Nothing the narcissist ever does will be more cruel than us leaving them. How does someone get this stupid? Unfortunately, all too easily. I dealt with the non-cruelty of going no contact here.

Next we see the presentation of some texts which we are to assume support this person's points. First, Matt. 18:15-18. I have commented on this passage here. Nothing in my post negates this text. In fact, this text tells us to make only three attempts to reach someone before we throw in the towel. It is kinda amusing that this person cites 1 Cor. 5 as their support when the last verse of this chapter finds Paul quoting the Pentateuch, "Therefore 'put away from yourselves that wicked person'." Kinda makes me giggle. This chapter contains specific admonishment for Christians to judge other Christians who engage in immoral behaviors. Somebody forgot to drink their cup of coffee before engaging in mental exercise.

The rest of the comment bores me to death so I'll not parse it except to point out that it contains the commenter's attempt to label me as selfish and working in tandem with the devil himself as a divider. No accountability is ever laid on the malignant narcissist by this person. Who is the real divider? You and I well know who it is. The malignant narcissist with his lying and slanderous tongue is usually at the root of divisions in families and churches and other social settings. I am not the divider. I point out who the real divider is...the malignant narcissist. That doesn't make me the problem simply because I have pointed out the problem.

In my opinion, this comment has value for several reasons. One of which I've already pointed out...it is a succinct distillation of the emotional abuse handed out to others by narcissist appeasers (especially of the Christian sort) to the victims of narcissism and therefore is a perfect illustration of my last two posts. It is abuse designed to minimize our experiences, to justify the narcissist, and to keep us locked forever in a macabre dance with the soul-sucker.

Next, it contains all the self-righteousness which characterizes the narcissist appeasers. This is something I have talked about in the last two posts. The narcissist appeasers always have a cloak of righteousness they wrap around themselves when approaching those of us who have finally seen the evil doer for what they are and are trying to protect ourselves and our loved ones from them. Regardless of whether the person is religious, or Christian, in profession...this self-righteousness always accompanies the narcissist appeasers. They find a way to assume a moral superiority to you and then smash you to bits. They are simply co-abusers with the narcissist and I find them every bit as dangerous...possibly more so...than the narcissist him or her self.

Last, and certainly not least, what we see demonstrated by this comment is the utter imperviousness to reason this type of person has. If you re-read the post this person was addressing you can see the amazing amount of logic and reality this person completely discounted in order to maintain their position. They may as well have concrete for a brain. This is important to note because you may find yourself trying to reason with one of these utter fools. Save your breath. And run. If allowed, a person like this will tie your hands and feet and tape your mouth in order to go on pretending the malignant narcissist is save-able and only misunderstood.

See, it isn't really about you or me. This type of person has limitless patience and hope for the evil doer. Because of that, this person has no pity or patience for the victims; this includes him or her self. I can feel a tiny bit badly for this person because they are also enslaving themselves along with others. But my compassion is limited because this person is making a volitional choice. I reject this person's right to make the choice for the rest of us when they obviously haven't any clue as to the true malignancy (i.e. evil) of narcissism. To stand on the side of saving a narcissist is to defend the narcissist's 'right' to destroy the rest of us. How is that compassion? How is that Christian? Christ came to "set the captives free". He is not a proponent of slavery or idolatry.

Both the narcissist and the narcissist's appeaser brethren are idolatrous members of the Cult of Nice. The worshipful deity is the narcissist; the lesser deity are those who keep the god fed with the flesh of humanity. The priesthood of this cult is populated with the narcissist's appeasers. They are more righteous than anyone because they are the most devoted servants of the Narcissist god. If a priest of the Cult of Nice determines that you must be fed to the narcissist god in order to keep 'unity' and 'peace'...then bye-bye to you. You are not left with any right to appeal. No recourse to justice. Your moral superiors have spoken and you must die.

For the rest of us the Cult of Nice is anything but nice.

Letting Go of a Fantasy so You Can Grab Hold of Real Life

Occasionally I will use Google to see what people "out there" are saying about my blog. I was very interested to see someone define my blog as "too negative" and then go on to describe the hope for redemption they still nurture for their narcissist parent all stated inside the context of being a good Christian.

I find this comment about my blog very interesting because it is so upside down from the usual. It is an inverse viewpoint...the flipside of the reactions of others to my ruminations. Why the dichotomous difference in opinion? I'll share my theories.

I completely agree that this blog would appear to be very negative to someone who is determined to believe it is their Christian duty to not only believe in the hope for redemption for the narcissist, but to also believe they must stay with the narcissist to ensure that outcome. I'm obviously very negative on these points. I do not in any way encourage people to nurture hope for the narcissist's eventual reformation, nor do I encourage anyone's savior complex. In fact, I categorically state that the hope is so very slim as to be statistically insignificant. I emphasize over and over the need for emotional and physical distance from the vampires among us. To the person dedicated to believing the unbelievable, yeah, I "get" that I'm a bucket of cold water.

Here's the deal. I am completely dedicated to reality. Realists are often accused of being negative because some aspects of reality are not pretty. For those who are in constant pursuit of dreams and rainbows the realist is a curmudgeon. Curmudgeons can't get no respect from the idealists.

Many of you have been slamming your heads against the brick wall otherwise known as the narcissist for so long your brain pan is seriously dented making you worry about possible brain damage. You've expended herculean amounts of energy trying to find ways to make the narcissist happy only to fail endlessly. You come here and find out that you don't have to kill yourself in order to hopefully save the narcissist because it is humanly impossible to save them. You find out that you can't save the narcissist, you can only save yourself and your family from them. You find out you aren't responsible for saving the narcissist, and you breathe for the first time in years. You've tried to accomplish the impossible for years now and are ready to embark on the possible. So when you come here to read you find hope and relief for your weary heart and mind. The very opposite of "too negative"...you find hope and positive direction for your future here. The negative news about the narcissist (unreformable) translates into very positive news for you: freedom to pursue life without them.

Perhaps this should be the motto for my blog:

Close your heart off to the impossible -- Open your heart to the possible.

You can not insist on clinging to a fantasy and have any hope of living successfully in reality. Real life is where the really good stuff happens. It is a shame to miss out on the lasting and real joys life offers by persisting on living in la-la land. If you insist on trying to accomplish the impossible you will end up having accomplished nothing. If you can let go of trying to do the impossible it opens up the possible before your feet. We accomplish a lot more in our lives when we persist in pursuing the possible.

Some things truly are impossible. Here in America there is a lore, a mythos, that we can dream the impossible dream and then go out and make that dream come true. Truly, people have often accomplished what seemed to be impossible through very hard work and absolute dedication to their goal. Obviously, they proved the impossible to be possible. So they really weren't pursuing the impossible, were they. But we like to take those success stories and go on to pretend that anything is possible if we just want it enough. As if the strength of our wishing can make anything happen. This is the way children think.

Since I was a child I have wished I could fly. I would often have dreams when I was a child of being able to fly under my own power. If I spent every waking moment telling myself that I could actually fly on my own (without mechanized assistance) then surely I would sprout wings, right? Would all of you be cruel curmudgeons if you stuck a needle in my dream balloon by telling me I was wasting my time and emotional energy on the impossible? No, you would be doing me a favor by helping me realize I was in danger of losing out on the good things in life that were possible for me to gain if I would only decide to abandon my dedication to the impossible.

Face it folks, some things are impossible to accomplish. This may go against your belief in miracles or in the power of visualization, but the fact remains. There are plenty of things we as human beings can not do no matter how hard we try. Reforming a narcissist falls into this category. We lack the power to change another human being. Period. We can barely change ourselves let alone take on a successful project of changing another human being...and a profoundly disordered one at that.

I do not peddle pipe dreams here. People have to go somewhere else for that. I'm not interested in supporting someone's vain fantasy about helping or reforming the narcissist. My goal here is not to cut any slack for the immoral narcissist who cuts a swathe of misery through the lives of others. I am all for supporting those who can see their way clear to leave the evil and immoral one to themselves to live in the hell of their own devising. Even God Himself does this. Are we saying we better than Him by persisting in our belief that the persistently and consistently evil narcissist can "see the light" only if we stick with them? The worship of one's self is idolatry. The narcissist is engaged in a complete dedication to their worship of self. What is God's message to the persistent idolater?

"Ephraim is joined to idols: let him alone." Hosea 4:17

I refuse to pretend I am wiser than the God who made this pronouncement. I contend that leaving the narcissist to his self-worship is Biblical and righteous.

Savior Complex

Otherwise known as beating your head against a wall...

If you are under the misconception that you could someday fill the attention-cup of the narcissist it is time for a reality check. There is no filling their vast reservoir. You can labor intensively for the rest of your life only to find yourself being condemned by the narcissist for never doing anything for them. (I'm betting you've already heard the narcissist say something like this.) At some point they will push you to utter hopelessness if you have insisted on clinging to the hope that you could ever be enough for them. My advice? Give it up now. Don't wait to hit the dregs of despair. Take that as sage advice from the voice of experience...because that is what it is.

Are you one of those people with a savior-complex? Are you convinced that the narcissist's redemption lies in the vast repository of love and hope you keep your heart? Alas, you have my very deepest sympathies. I assure you, at some point you will find yourself crashed upon the rocks of reality. Reality is this: no one can save the narcissist. How many more years of your life are you willing to waste on a project that is doomed to utter failure? A saviour can only save someone who recognizes their need for salvation. The narcissist is above all that. You are his inferior. You are the one in need of reformation so you can better fulfill the narcissist's endless demands.

And, please, think about this: When you expend yourself to fulfill the demands of the narcissist it is exactly the same as granting every petulant wish of a four year old. Has any four year old become better behaved by this indulgence? Quite the opposite. Neither will the narcissist. By sticking with him you are making him worse.

Stop right here and let that sink all the way in.

By staying with the narcissist you are part of the problem, not the solution. The only hope for the narcissist, as slim as that hope is, is to find himself utterly alone. It is the only time the narcissist has to confront herself. Only a crisis will induce a narcissist to seek out help from a professional. Chances are very small that the narcissist will stick with therapy long enough to deal with their real issue which is their narcissism. Once their presenting problem (i.e. depression) is fixed, they flit off never to be seen by their therapist again. But that isn't your problem either. Life is too short to waste it on someone who can never reciprocate, who is incapable of entering into your feelings, who will suck the life out of you and then kick your corpse as you lay lifeless reviling you for dying on them. Give your regard, your love, your energies to someone who can actually appreciate it.